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Will SB consider some type of upgrade to the Paramount ME to have closed-loop encoders like the AP 1600 GTO?

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aritomo Posted: 05-05-2012 4:00 PM

Thanks, Ari

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Aritomo Shinozaki, DeepSkyWest

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Aritomo:
Will SB consider some type of upgrade to the Paramount ME to have closed-loop encoders like the AP 1600 GTO?
The costs to engineer and redesign the existing Paramount ME to house the encoders, coupled with the cost of the closed loop encoder hardware itself versus the benefits may preclude us from doing so.

Here's a related thread on this subject: http://www.bisque.com/sc/forums/p/12904/48852.aspx#48852

(We're hoping to incorporate absolute encoders in future mount designs.)

Daniel R. Bisque

Software Bisque, Inc.

862 Brickyard Circle

Golden, Colorado 80403-8058

Office Hours: 8 a.m.-5 p.m. Monday-Friday GMT-7:00

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I was checking with the TDM inventor (the closed-loop encoder guy for various mounts) and he says he has a prototype working for the Paramount ME.  I'll investigate further and pass along anything I find of interest.

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Aritomo Shinozaki, DeepSkyWest

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Aritomo:
and he says he has a prototype working for the Paramount ME.  I'll investigate further and pass along anything I find of interest.
Interesting news.  Thanks and please keep us posted.

Daniel R. Bisque

Software Bisque, Inc.

862 Brickyard Circle

Golden, Colorado 80403-8058

Office Hours: 8 a.m.-5 p.m. Monday-Friday GMT-7:00

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phcjpp:
Yikes!

Step one of the installation procedure on this web page is very disconcerting. 

Are the manufacturers of this product aware that the "circular cap" they recommend removing is integral to the mount's structural design and integrity, and defines the preload of the right ascension bearings? 

This is akin to replacing the lug nuts on the wheel of your car.  If the replacement components are not designed properly, and the correct torque applied when tightening the replacement component, the results can be catastrophic!

Daniel R. Bisque

Software Bisque, Inc.

862 Brickyard Circle

Golden, Colorado 80403-8058

Office Hours: 8 a.m.-5 p.m. Monday-Friday GMT-7:00

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Eek. That doesn't sound good. Shame though as it may have helped hold up the value of the generation 1 ME's.

I have already per-ordered the ME II to replace my version one - would have been a nice option for whomever buys my one.

Cheers

Chris

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Daniel,

While I can appreciate your concern that modification work is done properly, isn't "catastrophic" a bit ovr the top? Lug nuts are removed and millions of wheels are replaced everyday. My ME is long out of warranty and if I decide to install an aftermarket product like the TDM, isn't that my risk?  What is the spec for the RA bearing preload? What is the recommended torque for the cap?

Jim McSheehy

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trimil:
isn't "catastrophic" a bit ovr the top?
Perhaps.  Software Bisque would be remiss by not pointing out potential issues with a replacement component.  I hope you can understand this.  (And, you are more than welcome to pay for SB's liability insurance.)

trimil:
Lug nuts are removed and millions of wheels are replaced everyday.
We can take this analogy only so far. 

  • The original lug nuts are almost always used (and not replaced by lug nuts from a "unknown" third-party manufacturer).
  • Most lug nuts are replaced by experienced technicians using torque wrenchs to ensure proper installation. 

trimil:
My ME is long out of warranty and if I decide to install an aftermarket product like the TDM, isn't that my risk?
Of course it is.  If /when something should happen to the Paramount ME due to the installation of a third-party component, can I give out your phone number for help?  Would you like to be responsible for potential repairs?

trimil:
What is the spec for the RA bearing preload? What is the recommended torque for the cap?
Forthcoming. 16 ft lb.

Daniel R. Bisque

Software Bisque, Inc.

862 Brickyard Circle

Golden, Colorado 80403-8058

Office Hours: 8 a.m.-5 p.m. Monday-Friday GMT-7:00

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I would like to make a couple more comments. First, it is great if there is an aftermarket item that offers benefits to the Paramount ME. It would have been nice to receive one of the units before going to market so that we could insure it does not compromise the original design. For example, the replacement nut should be properly sized so it makes contact with the inner race of the bearing only. The thread engagement should be sufficient to handle several hundred pounds of preload.

Note: If this component were placed on the declination axis, poorly machined threads could result in the entire declination gear assembly (and telescope) dropping out of the mount when the meridian is crossed. While the right ascension axis never goes "downhill" in this manner, it is important to be keenly aware of this component's purpose.

I realize we might sound overly cautious but the instructions provided indicated "as tight as you can by hand", and this will probably work fine most of the time. But if there nut has no grease, and the threads are rough, vastly different results will be obtained. There are hundreds of ways this part can be made improperly, hence our concern.

I trust the suppliers of this add-on have done their homework and tested the results. Does anyone know the resolution of the encoder?

Steve

Stephen M. Bisque

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OK well, maybe its me, but I looked at this gadget, and if you look at the installation it shows it being placed on the back of the PME where the cables go through....ummmm....what am I missing here???  Lots of references to the RA shaft but I don't see how this all comes together someone refocus me please!

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I looked at the installation instructions and if I am reading this correctly they have the encoder attached to the pome where the cables go through the mount. I mmean the picture couldn't be clearer so how has that got anything to do with the R a?  Someone please refocus me please!

peter

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peter27284:
Lots of references to the RA shaft but I don't see how this all comes together someone refocus me please!
The Software Bisque engineered right ascension housing nut must be removed and then replaced by a third-party component that may or may not meet the required specifications for this component.  That's the issue.

Daniel R. Bisque

Software Bisque, Inc.

862 Brickyard Circle

Golden, Colorado 80403-8058

Office Hours: 8 a.m.-5 p.m. Monday-Friday GMT-7:00

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Peter, that place where the cables go through and the encoder attaches is one end of the RA axis.  It isn't just an opening where cables go through, but is the hollow RA axis itself.

Mark

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